I'm fairly new to Umbraco, so pardon me if this has been asked many times before. I tried to search, but the results do not answer my question completely.
My question is how do we update an already deployed site? While retaining data that is already there.
Surprisingly the documenation page ends at 'Development Guidelines'. I have read about Courier, but it currenlty does not support version 7 so I cannot use it. I also checked out uSync but haven't tried it yet. There maybe other options.
Can someone point out how to do this, best practices, what to look out for, etc? Not necessarily explain it all here, but links will do :).
Btw I am experienced it deploying non-Umbraco .Net websites, it's just this framework that I'm new at.
The initial deploy is usually done by scripting the database and the import it on the database server of the production environment and then files are usually deployed using FTP for instance.
Once the initial steps have been done you could use Courier (currently for versions lower than 7 as you mention), uSync or uMport.
You could also do things manually but that's probably too inefficient.
Using Umbraco As A Service could also be an option once it's open to the public since it takes care of all the infrastructure for you so all you need to do is push a button to deploy between environments.
I hope some of these input are useful - And I'm looking forward to hearing more from you if you have any further questions.
May I know why there isn't any documentation (my apologies if I hadn't been looking hard enough) about deploying updates to an existing Umbraco installation?
It's easier to deploy first time, you just copy everything. But for deploying updates, shouldn't there be a guide on what files/folders and/or tables/records should be copied? This may be obvious if I spend enough time studying the framework, but still a quick deployment (or redeployment) guide would be nice :).
But I guess the current options now are uSync and uMport. Can you cite any advantage of one over the other? Or is it for me to find out? :)
That's a good question - I don't think anyone has ever thought about documenting it officially. I think it's been answered a couple of times on the forum though but those posts are hard to dig up - Especially if you're a newcomer.
But I also think that everyone has their own approach - But perhaps it would be nice to write some guidelines / rules of thumb so people can have a starting point at least. But as you may know the Umbraco project relies heavily on community contributions so I doubt that HQ will spend time on writing such documentation (Not enough manpower) - But luckily there has been many contributions from the community when they find the time. If you have the time and would like to contribute you can read more about how to do it here http://our.umbraco.org/contribute/contribute-to-the-documentation - Or anyone else who comes across this post (If they have the time) - I'm making a note about it at least and perhaps some day I'll find the time to write something :) - It's just matter of getting it started - If someone think something could be explained in more detail etc. they can just suggest changes for improvements by making a new PR.
In regards to using uSync and uMport I'm still a n00b at that and have not really tried them yet. I think the advantage of uMport is that it does not rely on any internal Umbraco API's, which makes independent if something should change in the core of Umbraco and I think the way the packages work differs as well. Would be nice if someone did a write-up ;-)
Have fun and please share if you discover something interesting.
IMHO HQ should allot some time and manpower for deployment strategies. I mean how long should it take to write that stuff? :)
Would you know how many potential users passed on Umbraco because they cannot find any documentation on deployment strategies? While I am sure that a lot of contributors are more than capable of providing this, nothing beats the aura of having 'official' stamped any documentation, to newcomers at least :D.
I truly hope we (me and my company as a whole) would be long time Umbraco users (we have used DNN before) and hopefully contribute something.
Currently I'm checking out uSync, too early to tell if I'm getting somewhere though.
I can understand your argument and it's probably a valid point. However Umbraco is not only a HQ project it's a community project. And there are so many cool things being build on top of Umbraco and in many different ways so documenting some specific deployment guidelines can be a bit hard since HQ does not have a living chance to know if you're using a 3rd party package, which means you need to be aware of something specific to that package in order to do a successful deployment.
I can't imagine anyone doing Umbraco not using at least one 3rd party package. If you're using a shop package then you need to consider if anything special needs to be done to make a sucssfull deploy. If you're doing a custom integration to a 3rd party service you need to take that into account as well etc. etc.
Also some larger agencies are probably having a complex setup with build servers, source control hooks, continous integration etc. where a minor agency or a freelancer is using a simple FTP approach manually. And if you're one of the cool kids you're jumping on the Umbraco as a Service bandwagon and then it's almost automated :)
But yes of course some common hints/tips would indeed be nice - I'm just saying it's not necessarily easy to write about deployment strategies since Umbraco is being used in all kind of ways so there might be MANY versions of a strategy.
Don't be shy to share your own thoughts and experiences doing deployments. Perhaps one should try and add a new page to the documentation during the summer - I have some ideas for starting points at least in regards to how we do it where I work.
Thanks again Jan. I understand that there are quite a number of ways of deploying an Umbraco system. I guess that's because it's a light framework and is very flexible.
I really was just referring to a basic guide. For a core installation. At the very least, what core tables to update (data and/or structure if necessary), and what core files or folders to copy. What should not be overwritten on a deployed site. Anything beyond that, the user has figure out for himself or try out the existing tools such as uSync :).
Deployment strategies to deployed sites
Hi,
I'm fairly new to Umbraco, so pardon me if this has been asked many times before. I tried to search, but the results do not answer my question completely.
My question is how do we update an already deployed site? While retaining data that is already there.
Surprisingly the documenation page ends at 'Development Guidelines'. I have read about Courier, but it currenlty does not support version 7 so I cannot use it. I also checked out uSync but haven't tried it yet. There maybe other options.
Can someone point out how to do this, best practices, what to look out for, etc? Not necessarily explain it all here, but links will do :).
Btw I am experienced it deploying non-Umbraco .Net websites, it's just this framework that I'm new at.
Thanks in advance!
Anyone?
Hi Paul
The initial deploy is usually done by scripting the database and the import it on the database server of the production environment and then files are usually deployed using FTP for instance.
Once the initial steps have been done you could use Courier (currently for versions lower than 7 as you mention), uSync or uMport.
You could also do things manually but that's probably too inefficient.
Using Umbraco As A Service could also be an option once it's open to the public since it takes care of all the infrastructure for you so all you need to do is push a button to deploy between environments.
I hope some of these input are useful - And I'm looking forward to hearing more from you if you have any further questions.
Cheers, Jan
Hi Jan,
Thanks for the reply!
May I know why there isn't any documentation (my apologies if I hadn't been looking hard enough) about deploying updates to an existing Umbraco installation?
It's easier to deploy first time, you just copy everything. But for deploying updates, shouldn't there be a guide on what files/folders and/or tables/records should be copied? This may be obvious if I spend enough time studying the framework, but still a quick deployment (or redeployment) guide would be nice :).
But I guess the current options now are uSync and uMport. Can you cite any advantage of one over the other? Or is it for me to find out? :)
Thanks again,
Paul
Hi Paul
That's a good question - I don't think anyone has ever thought about documenting it officially. I think it's been answered a couple of times on the forum though but those posts are hard to dig up - Especially if you're a newcomer.
But I also think that everyone has their own approach - But perhaps it would be nice to write some guidelines / rules of thumb so people can have a starting point at least. But as you may know the Umbraco project relies heavily on community contributions so I doubt that HQ will spend time on writing such documentation (Not enough manpower) - But luckily there has been many contributions from the community when they find the time. If you have the time and would like to contribute you can read more about how to do it here http://our.umbraco.org/contribute/contribute-to-the-documentation - Or anyone else who comes across this post (If they have the time) - I'm making a note about it at least and perhaps some day I'll find the time to write something :) - It's just matter of getting it started - If someone think something could be explained in more detail etc. they can just suggest changes for improvements by making a new PR.
In regards to using uSync and uMport I'm still a n00b at that and have not really tried them yet. I think the advantage of uMport is that it does not rely on any internal Umbraco API's, which makes independent if something should change in the core of Umbraco and I think the way the packages work differs as well. Would be nice if someone did a write-up ;-)
Have fun and please share if you discover something interesting.
Cheers, Jan
Hi Jan,
IMHO HQ should allot some time and manpower for deployment strategies. I mean how long should it take to write that stuff? :)
Would you know how many potential users passed on Umbraco because they cannot find any documentation on deployment strategies? While I am sure that a lot of contributors are more than capable of providing this, nothing beats the aura of having 'official' stamped any documentation, to newcomers at least :D.
I truly hope we (me and my company as a whole) would be long time Umbraco users (we have used DNN before) and hopefully contribute something.
Currently I'm checking out uSync, too early to tell if I'm getting somewhere though.
Thanks again for your help.
Paul
Hi Paul
I can understand your argument and it's probably a valid point. However Umbraco is not only a HQ project it's a community project. And there are so many cool things being build on top of Umbraco and in many different ways so documenting some specific deployment guidelines can be a bit hard since HQ does not have a living chance to know if you're using a 3rd party package, which means you need to be aware of something specific to that package in order to do a successful deployment.
I can't imagine anyone doing Umbraco not using at least one 3rd party package. If you're using a shop package then you need to consider if anything special needs to be done to make a sucssfull deploy. If you're doing a custom integration to a 3rd party service you need to take that into account as well etc. etc.
Also some larger agencies are probably having a complex setup with build servers, source control hooks, continous integration etc. where a minor agency or a freelancer is using a simple FTP approach manually. And if you're one of the cool kids you're jumping on the Umbraco as a Service bandwagon and then it's almost automated :)
But yes of course some common hints/tips would indeed be nice - I'm just saying it's not necessarily easy to write about deployment strategies since Umbraco is being used in all kind of ways so there might be MANY versions of a strategy.
Don't be shy to share your own thoughts and experiences doing deployments. Perhaps one should try and add a new page to the documentation during the summer - I have some ideas for starting points at least in regards to how we do it where I work.
Cheers, Jan
Thanks again Jan. I understand that there are quite a number of ways of deploying an Umbraco system. I guess that's because it's a light framework and is very flexible.
I really was just referring to a basic guide. For a core installation. At the very least, what core tables to update (data and/or structure if necessary), and what core files or folders to copy. What should not be overwritten on a deployed site. Anything beyond that, the user has figure out for himself or try out the existing tools such as uSync :).
Regards,
Paul
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